1994 Rover 414Sli

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ROVER-25X
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Re: 1994 Rover 414Sli

#421 Post by ROVER-25X » Tue Aug 21, 2018 5:10 am

Some good graft done there bud. :clapping
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Re: 1994 Rover 414Sli

#422 Post by 1234dist » Tue Aug 21, 2018 6:52 am

can you do a dash cam shot of the rear seats?

I'm intrigued.

Also if it feels any different to drive without the rear stiffening braces?
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Re: 1994 Rover 414Sli

#423 Post by Vulgalour » Tue Aug 21, 2018 7:33 pm

Got in and did a bit more today. I wanted to do the underseal, fit the tank, and get the door cards on. I managed some of this. First, the underseal. It probably doesn't need it but since this is an all-weather-car and I have taken it through a couple of winters now, it seemed prudent to give it a lick of the old black gunk anyway. There's a handy pressing the length of the sill which means you can put a modest tidemark in without it being visible once the car is on its wheels. Masking tape was my friend for a nice crisp edge to the black stuff.

Image20180821-01 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


Image20180821-02 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


The fuel tank is a tricky operation to refit, luckily there were two of us and a gearbox hydraulic lift which made the job bearable. There's a whole host of pipes that needed reconnecting and I hadn't had the foresight to plug the various tubes on the petrol tank while it was off the car so quite a lot of fuel has evaporated away, unfortunately.

Image20180821-03 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


Image20180821-04 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


Mike did battle with the fuel lines and I busied myself with other bits and bobs. After that, I re-activated the seatbelt pre-tensioner things which is a simple case of taking the red tag out of the slot and clipping it back onto the end of the tube where it lives before refitting the trim.

Image20180821-05 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


Image20180821-06 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


Image20180821-07 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


Also got the lower windscreen trim reinstated. Annoyingly, one of the A pllar trim clips has broken a leg at some point between removal and coming to refit, to stop it flapping about I'll just glue it down with some sealant when I get a chance. Windscreen arms will go back on once I've repainted them satin black and bought a pair of new wipers, since new windscreen deserves brand new wipers.

Image20180821-08 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


I looked over the spare doors and realistically the only things worth salvaging for me are the side trims, the door seals, and the glass. The doors themselves aren't really better or worse than the ones on my car. So if you want a full set of Flame Red doors (fit both saloon and hatchback, probably estate too) that are basically sound shells, they're free to anyone that wants to collect them. I shan't be moving house with them so if they aren't collected they will go in the bin.


I swapped over the driver's door seal. This involved knocking out the roll pin for the door stay to get the seal in the correct place and salvaging a good two thirds of the clips that hold the seal in place since my old one had barely any attached. The old seal was fairly knackered too, stretched on the bottom edge and had a hole missing at the top so this will hopefully be an improvement. It's a bit of a weird seal, when I salvage the others I'll try to remember to take some photographs to show you the clips on three edges and the rail it squidges into on the top.

Image20180821-09 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


Finally I tried (and failed) to fit the driver's door card. I salvaged a speaker off one of the spare doors since my original had torn, and I made sure to swap my original window switch pack onto the new door card since I wasn't as sure the new one worked. The last time I did this door card it fought me quite a lot, it seems just as you've got one bit seated, two other bits pop out of place and when you correct those, it jumps off somewhere else. Probably the worst job on the car so far, and I've four of them to do. Oh well.

Image20180821-10 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


The car was started after I'd completed the magical mystery dance of the buttons to get the keyfob to talk to the car again since the battery has been off. No fuel leaks, no problems, all good. So pre-MoT we're down to fitting some new bushes at the back - not a fail or even advisory, but I've got them and now is the best time to do them - finish fitting the door cards, new wiper blades, and then a really thorough clean. Should be sorted in the next few days.
Current Fleet:
1980 Austin Princess 2 1700 HL
1994 Rover 414 SLi

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Re: 1994 Rover 414Sli

#424 Post by Vulgalour » Tue Aug 21, 2018 7:38 pm

Those diagonal braces aren't for stiffening, they're just to stop the back seat collapsing into the boot. All the stiffening is going to be in the parcel shelf that runs the width of the car, and since that's tied to the towers with the new brackets, I doubt there'll be any noticeable difference. At some point I'll do a proper shot of the back seats in action, they work exactly as they should.

I wouldn't recommend it as a job, all the same. I'd also use rivnuts instead of welding in nuts and bolts, because that would be loads easier. I may find other tweaks I want to do to improve things once I've tested them a bit but for now they seem sturdy and will be practical come house move day since it'll allow me to put more stuff in my car easily.
Current Fleet:
1980 Austin Princess 2 1700 HL
1994 Rover 414 SLi

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Re: 1994 Rover 414Sli

#425 Post by ROVER-25X » Tue Aug 21, 2018 9:39 pm

Coming along though. :wink3
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Re: 1994 Rover 414Sli

#426 Post by redandwhitE » Wed Aug 22, 2018 4:59 am

As a ham fisted amateur, reading this and other detailed threads (the orange engined track car for example) is a good push for me to tackle some jobs. Not saying that they will be on these kind of scales but there are some simple maintenance bits in these threads that I will adopt, not only for my Rover but for my other cars too.

Thanks to all concerned....and keep it up.
1995 416 SLi (Ostensibly BRG) - on the road
2000 Citroen Xantia Estate (silver) - on the road
2006 Ford Transit (white, what else) - on the road
1972 Mercedes 350 SL (red) - not on the road
1998 Audi Cabriolet (maroon) - not on the road

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Re: 1994 Rover 414Sli

#427 Post by Vulgalour » Wed Aug 22, 2018 6:12 pm

Everyone starts out as a ham-fisted amateur, just a few years ago I barely new one end of an engine from the other, now thanks to the internet and forums I'm moderately competent, even adventurous, with my tinkerings. So never be afraid to have a go, just get out there and get spannering. You'll be amazed at what you can achieve, and in some cases, completely fudge up.

---

So nearly finished now, certainly finished enough to go for an MoT. Courtesy of a chap on the club forum who was breaking a tourer, some trim bits arrived. I've not had much joy finding the chrome bezel for the rear window window so that was particularly welcome and the square blanking plates are another tricky item to source if you can't get to a car that's being broken for spares.

Image20180822-01 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


Primary job today was getting the door cards in, which is a thankless task. Between the new and old door cards I had just enough trim clips. I also had to swap the driver's door grab handle as it had lifted on one corner on the new card where on my old one it was in good shape. Happily, the only interior bit left to do now are the rear arch trims that go alongside the seats and the revarnishing of the wood, both of which are low priority and will get done after I've moved house if need be since I don't need specialist tools to do them. Here's the rear seat in action, I suspect this is going to be quite useful come moving day.

Image20180822-02 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


Base up. You do have to make sure the front seats are far enough forwards, these seats are chunkier than the velour versions it seems.

Image20180822-03 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


You can leave the base down and fold either half of the back rest forwards, just not flat because of the shape of things. So while it is a 60/40, because of the solid base it's not as much of a benefit as it could be. Still, 60% side down.

Image20180822-04 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


40% side down. Nice flat loading space. There's a few times this would have been handy over the last few years so now I've done this I expect I'll never, ever use it after the house move.

Image20180822-05 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


I still haven't trimmed the excess corners off the moulded boot sides yet and I forgot to push the carpet down flat from when I've been fiddling with stuff. You get the idea though. The red bodywork will be hidden once I've trimmed the plastic arch trims down properly and in use I'd stow the head restraints in the rear foot well rather than leaving them on the parcel shelf like that. It is nice being able to remove the restraints, and necessary for folding down the seat back properly.

Image20180822-06 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


Image20180822-07 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


Then I remembered I hadn't welded up that crack in the driver's door. Since I'm not swapping doors around, it made sense to do this job now since it's an easy one, which annoyingly meant disconnecting the battery again.

Image20180822-08 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


A blob of weld, a flap of the angry disc, and a splosh of paint and it's nice and secure again. No discernible difference in using the door but at least I know it's done and safe to stick the door card back on.

Image20180822-09 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


Surprisingly, key fob and car communicated almost instantly when the battery was reconnected. New seats are quite firm, but supportive in the same way as the old ones, I think I'll get on okay with them. It's nice not to have the springs and stuff in the base poking me in the bottom since these new seats actually have some foam left in them, so I hope dead-bum-syndrome won't be an issue on longer drives now. Cabin feels a bit more cramped with everything being so dark in there compared to the grey velour, especially without the wood trim, but this is balanced out by the carpet being an actual colour and pulling the colour out in the seat cloth, which at least prevents it being a plain black hole.

Image20180822-10 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr


Technically, it's now MoT ready. I'm going to replace the suspension bushes before then anyway so I know they're done. It was very strange getting behind the wheel of it after using the Princess for so many months, I almost felt too big for the car.
Current Fleet:
1980 Austin Princess 2 1700 HL
1994 Rover 414 SLi

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Re: 1994 Rover 414Sli

#428 Post by ROVER-25X » Sun Aug 26, 2018 6:43 pm

My 111 had an identical loadspace arrangement, very handy.
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Re: 1994 Rover 414Sli

#429 Post by gbs100 » Wed Aug 29, 2018 12:27 am

Can I step in to save your spare doors... :o

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Re: 1994 Rover 414Sli

#430 Post by Vulgalour » Thu Aug 30, 2018 11:46 am

You may. I did send you a message about the passenger one you were interested in but I suspect it got lost in the aether.
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1980 Austin Princess 2 1700 HL
1994 Rover 414 SLi

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Re: 1994 Rover 414Sli

#431 Post by skip_rat » Thu Aug 30, 2018 11:51 am

Great work on that folding rear seat conversion. I had been wondering if it was possible since I bought the 416. Now I need to find a set of beige cloth folding rear seats. :D

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Re: 1994 Rover 414Sli

#432 Post by gbs100 » Thu Aug 30, 2018 8:52 pm

Great just send me your address and contact details. I can pick them up next week.

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Re: 1994 Rover 414Sli

#433 Post by Vulgalour » Sun Sep 02, 2018 7:06 pm

PM incoming.

---

Decided to have a fettle with the wooden interior trim and see if I could do something about it being so faded and yellow. The original lacquer had gone very cloudy, especially compared to other R8s I've seen over the years, seemingly because this one has lived outside its entire life. Usually, lacquer either flakes off in big chunks making it really easy to deal with, or responds well to being chemically or abrasively stripped. Whatever Rover/Honda used on these, however, was impervious to everything but 80grit paper in a power sander. I employed a technique I've used before where you get a chisel-bladed craft knife and gently ease it under a damaged edge of the old lacquer and sort of slow-wiggle it up. Wear eye protection, the small pieces have a habit of firing off at great speed, usually straight for your eyes.

You can see here just how cloudy and yellow the original lacquer had gone. This is the dash insert and is easily the most faded and yellow of all the pieces on the car. There wasn't much sanding required because the lacquer had gone quite brittle so it all came off in this way.

Image20180902-01 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr

I had tried a few methods to remove the old lacquer including a bench mounted wire wheel (no really! Don't do this, it's too easy to man bits it up), and a polydisc in a grinder that I then clamped into the vice (this works well, but don't do this, it's too dangerous and too easy to take too much material off without realising it). Eventually, I settled on a combination of 80grit paper in a mouse type sander, a hand-sanding block, and the craft knife technique above. Chemical paint strippers, thinner, and various potions wouldn't even touch whatever it is. Mike and I wondered if it's some sort of epoxy resin rather than a more traditional varnish, especially with how sweet and plasticy it smells when you sand it (wear lung protection when sanding, kids).

Anyway, with a couple of pieces now back to bare veneer, I hit them with a coat of acrylic varnish. I've used ordinary automotive acrylic varnish before for wooden handles and bits of wood that are exposed to a lot of sunlight and not had a problem before with bleaching or cracking so it seemed a sensible option here. Things like beeswax or Danish Oil aren't really suitable since I want a very low maintenance finish and the satin varnish I've got is going to be the wrong finish for the style of the interior. There is, unfortunately, some bleaching of the wood for the dash top piece, there's not a great deal I can do about this so I'm just accepting it as part of the car's ever growing character.

Image20180902-02 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr

I would have liked to do more today but stripping off the old finish is incredibly time consuming and applying the new varnish requires drying/cure times between each coat since it needs sanding between each coat to get the finish I want. I did get far enough that I could compare a few pieces together and I have to say I'm quite surprised at how good the trims look. There's no stain or dye employed here, I'm just taking off an old yellowed finish and applying fresh clear finish which brings out the colour and pattern of the wood amazingly well. I genuinely expected it to all look bleached, but smart, not this nice, interesting dark wood I've ended up with instead.

Image20180902-03 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr

Image20180902-04 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr

I'm planning to apply a total of 4-6 coats of varnish to get the finish I want. It should be another job that ends up looking like I haven't done anything but that also improves the look of the interior considerably.
Current Fleet:
1980 Austin Princess 2 1700 HL
1994 Rover 414 SLi

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Re: 1994 Rover 414Sli

#434 Post by Vulgalour » Tue Sep 04, 2018 12:43 am

Rather than doing more woodwork, I've been dealing with other stuff in my mission to get the decks cleared. That meant stripping the useful bits off the spare doors so someone else can make use of them. I wanted the glass most of all to replace the few scratched ones on the car. These are slightly awkward to do because you have to unbolt them from the window mechanisms which is much easier when you can actually operate them, which when they're not connected to any power is quite difficult. I cheated by unbolting the mechs, dropping them into the doors and then unbolting the glass that way. The rear door glass needs a window guide to be unbolted and the rubber seals to be pulled out before the glass will come out of the door, which is about as annoying as you can imagine. Still, a full set of glass that matches the tint on my car ready to fit when I have the motivation to dismantle my doors and fanny about with this in the future.

Image20180903-01 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr

Then it was a case of salvaging the door seals. Not something I need right now but something that will definitely be more difficult to find in the future. I also salvaged all of the funny little clips that hold them in because they seem to break fairly regularly. I'm guessing these seals are a Honda thing. They don't go in with glue or clip on an edge, instead they squidge into a channel around the window frame and then have these little T clips the go into holes in the seal and push into holes in the door. It's really easy to tear the seal removing them because of these T clips, even when you're using a trim removal tool. It is not a design I like, I much prefer the old style where the seal pushes onto an edge and you use a rubber mallet for tight curves.

Image20180903-02 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr

Image20180903-03 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr

Image20180903-04 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr

Then Mike and I squidged some sealant around the broken clips in the A pillar trims since that's easier than trying to source and fit new clips and will do the job just fine. Tape is just there to hold everything until the sealant sets.
Image20180903-05 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr

That was it today. There's minor jobs to do, nothing that's particularly vital. Plenty of paint to sort out all over the car which I'm leaning more and more towards paying someone else to do piecemeal since you can with this colour scheme. Interior needs the rear arch trims either side of the rear seat fitting, the wood to be reinstalled when I've finished restoring it and eventually the parcel shelf needs redying so it matches the seats properly. There's a couple of popped stitches on the rear bench that needs fixing, a little bolster hole in the driver's seat that could do with being repaired. Mechanically it would benefit from the minor oil leak being fixed and new lower rear engine stay bushes being replaced. Or I could just ignore all of this because it doesn't affect the functionality of the car in any way. We'll see how much spare time I have before the house move as to what gets done.

Here's a random unit car park picture.
Image20180903-06 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr
Current Fleet:
1980 Austin Princess 2 1700 HL
1994 Rover 414 SLi

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Vulgalour
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Re: 1994 Rover 414Sli

#435 Post by Vulgalour » Mon Sep 10, 2018 5:30 pm

MoT ready now on this one. Decided not to address the very minor oil weep on the cam carrier before the MoT, it shouldn't cause an issue but will probably be an advisory. Shakycam employed to illustrate where the leak is here. The K series has the usual sump and headgasket seams, but it also has a cam carrier seam above the head gasket and a top cover/rocker cover seam above that, so Rover maximised the potential for oil leaks with this design as a result. It's weeping from the rear passenger side corner (impossible to photograph without taking parts off), and the front driver's corner has just started to be a little wet, though that could be wicking around from the back.

Image20180910-02 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr

The other job was to fit the new wiper blades, since I've got a new windscreen, and while I was at it I repainted the wiper arms which were looking very grey previously. There wasn't a lot of paint on the arms and after repainting them and refitting them I found that the driver's side one doesn't catch the bonnet when you open it now. There is definitely some play in the wiper mechanism somewhere, but the play goes away once the wipers have been used for a bit and doesn't stop the wipers working so I'm not faffing about trying to sort that until much later. I suspect it's a worn bush or rivet somewhere in the construction.

Image20180910-01 by Angyl Roper, on Flickr

So yeah. That's about as exciting as things have got here lately.
Current Fleet:
1980 Austin Princess 2 1700 HL
1994 Rover 414 SLi

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